Odd, sad, and odder yet
Why PNCC members should use care when referring to themselves as the “National Catholic Church” without the PNCC qualifier:
From the Florida Times Union: St. Anthony’s celebrates priest’s 10th anniversary
St. Anthony’s National Catholic Church in Jacksonville will celebrate the 10-year anniversary of its priest’s ordination during the 10:30 a.m. Mass on Aug. 15.
The Rev. Marsha McKinlay Brandt is pastor of the parish, part of the National Catholic Church of North America. The denomination ordains women to the priesthood and permits clergy to marry. Formerly known as the Free Catholic Church, it is not part of the Roman Catholic Church…
Noting oneself as the “National Catholic Church” confuses us with a lot of vagante communities out there. If you visit their website, note the stress on “Apostolic succession,” a common feature of vagante type churches.
When the gods get angry
A sad story, but reading the Polish struck me as funny. From Wirtualna Polska: Piorun śmiertelnie poraził mężczyznę
Ok. 50-letni mężczyzna nie żyje, a drugi został ranny w wyniku porażenia piorunem w Mokrej koło Jarosławia (Podkarpackie) – poinformował rzecznik podkarpackiej policji, Paweł Międlar.
– Obaj pracujący przy budowie autostrady mężczyźni przed deszczem schronili się pod drzewem. Jednego z nich piorun poraził śmiertelnie. Jego kolega trafił do szpitala, nie pamięta jednak zdarzenia – powiedział Międlar.
Na Podkarpaciu gwałtowne burze w pojawiły się głównie w okolicach Przemyśla, Lubaczowa, Jarosławia, Przeworska i Leska. Uszkodziły m.in. most w Majdanie Sieniawskim koło Przeworska
In short, lighting struck and killed a 50 year old man in Jarosław. Another man was injured. If you don’t know, Piorun was the name of the god of thunder and lightning in Slavic mythology. Reading the article’s title overly literally, Piorun fatally struck a man.
Eternal rest grant onto the man who was killed, O Lord.
With all due respect, Deacon Jim, both to you and to the PNCC, one has to wonder if all this “we are not vagante” in fact betrays certain underlying self-doubts about exactly what the status of the PNCC actually IS.
Parishes like the one I belong to, happens to be an area where not many Polish people reside. In order to grow,we have to depend on members who are not Polish or have Polish backgrounds. This limits our ability to attract new members. Using the title Polish National Catholic tends to infer that you must be Polish to belong.
Fr. Greg, Mr. Mahalik,
As you can see, a topic of some discussion within the PNCC. I still like the line – “you don’t have to be Italian to be Roman Catholic,” but it is an identity issue. Besides identity, the Church’s historical roots must be preserved and we must avoid confusion with the vagantes that are so far off the Catholic faith path that one wouldn’t want to be confused with them — and there are a lot out there, almost all referring to themselves as “National Catholic” (see the Lambda National Catholic Church for example – Google it, I won’t link).
Yes, most parishes are no longer predominately Polish-American in character or by demographic. The best solution, I personally believe, and the one allowed by the Church, is that parishes should identify themselves as XYZ National Catholic Church, PNCC. It retains the uniqueness of the Church, its history and identity, without causing confusion.
I’d long noticed that name problem too. Wasn’t one of the gay churches’ founders an ex-PNCC priest, whence he got the idea for the name?
Fr Greg, I don’t think it’s insecurity but clarity. The PNCC is not a homosexualist church.
I’ve not seen many PNCC parishes but so far they’ve all been Slavic (two Polish and one Slovak). My impression of the PNCC, from a friend who knows them well, is of fourth-generation Polish-Americans, parish-orientated and culturally conservative, served by priests from Poland who left RC to marry.
But yes, there’s the other problem of keeping ‘Polish’/people think you have to be Polish. Partly why the Russian Orthodox Greek Catholic Church turned into the OCA in 1970, that and it wanted to be THE Orthodox Church in the US and tried to be multiethnic with other ethnic Eastern European dioceses. (Also most of its people aren’t Russian-Americans but their Ruthenian-American cousins.)
Yes, one in particular, the American Catholic Church alleged to have been established by Vilatte. Their “Archbishop,” Robert Mary Clement, was in the PNCC at one time per their website. There are a few others out there that I know of, and perhaps one other man claiming to be a bishop.
Deacon Jim:
I think your suggestion for PNCC nomenclature is reasonable.
Young Fogey:
Whatever else it may mean, “vagante” is by no means synonymous with “homosexualist”, “gay-friendly, “inclusive” or any other such term. Many Churches, including my own, which we all can agree are indeed “vagante”, certainly don’t fall into the other category, and I doubt that anyone would identify TEC as being “vagante”.